Navigating Profession Pivots

Renata Bernarde (00:48)
Our visitor on the podcast in the present day is Priya Rathod. She’s a seasoned media skilled and a profession traits knowledgeable at Certainly, the place she helps professionals such as you navigate profession transitions, labor market shifts, and alter in hiring traits. She has a decade at Certainly and beforehand she held roles at MTV networks, Comcast, and Profession Builder. So she brings to this dialog a deep understanding of

tips on how to change Jobs and careers from a private perspective, in addition to her very data-driven work that she does at Certainly, taking a look at workforce traits and job seeker habits. You most likely know this, however Certainly is a number one international employment platform connecting job seekers with employers, and the corporate emphasizes data-driven insights to tell hiring traits and profession recommendation.

And we do focus on a few of the analytics and Information from the newest experiences that Certainly has produced.

Certainly additionally owns Glassdoor. You might have used Glassdoor earlier than, however should you haven’t, I might extremely advocate that you just do. IT’s a evaluation platform and we focus on IT throughout our chat as properly. Priya has contributed to Certainly’s thought management by means of articles that she writes on the platform’s weblog.

just like the recession-proof Jobs in a sure financial system. So search out that article. IT’s one to learn. She has additionally contributed to information articles which might be written in different platforms the place she’s ⁓ contacted to offer perception into career-related subjects like wage negotiations, for instance. And he or she serves because the co-chair of Certainly’s Dad and mom and Caregivers Inclusion Group.

advocating for office fairness and adaptability. We mentioned that a bit bit when she tells us why she thought Certainly was an incredible employer for herself. I at all times needed to have any person from Certainly on the podcast as a result of I believe IT’s a platform that every one of it’s essential to use. And I used to be actually grateful and grateful for Certainly.

to offer Priya to be on this episode with me. We had an incredible chat. I felt like I knew her. I felt like we have been on sync and you will note that we actually bounce off one another actually properly in our dialog. I needed this dialog to be very natural and so that you can be like a fly on the wall of our chat as should you have been having espresso with us. I do know we’re in several components of the world.

however IT was actually nice and IT felt actually, actually fantastic to have this dialog with any person that thinks quite a bit like me and has some extra perception to my anecdotal proof. ⁓ I hope you loved this. In the event you haven’t subscribed to the podcast of wherever you discovered us, please subscribe. We at all times deliver attention-grabbing company and I additionally do solo episodes that you just is perhaps curious about. You’ll be able to watch IT on YouTube. Typically I’ve little canine with me like in the present day.

So please give us a thumbs up, write us evaluation. IT helps us quite a bit and IT means quite a bit to me that you just’re right here in the present day. Take pleasure in this dialog.

Priya Bhola Rathod (04:11)
and I

love that you’re doing all this with the intention to assist all these job seekers on the market. Clearly, that’s one of many causes I joined Certainly. We assist folks get Jobs. That’s our mission. So I really like that that’s one thing you’re so invested in.

Renata Bernarde (04:16)
you

I’m and I’ve at all times been. I believe there have been a sprinkle of that in my earlier Jobs. I ponder if that occurred to you as properly, although you have been in several industries. I do know you’ve been at MTV and Comcast. Did folks come to you for profession recommendation as properly?

Priya Bhola Rathod (04:45)
Sure, sure, they did. And IT’s at all times been one thing my mates and I and my neighborhood and my community speak about fairly steadily. What are we engaged on proper now? The place will we wish to be? What are our plans? How will we assist one another get there? And so I believe that IT’s an ever evolving dialog, whether or not you may have a job otherwise you’re searching for a job. I believe that may be a dialog that’s at all times high of thoughts.

Renata Bernarde (05:11)
Yeah, and I really feel generally that now as a result of I don’t know if IT occurred to you, however as a result of I’m a coach now, I believe my mates are a bit intimidated to ask me the identical questions that they used to ask 5, 10 years in the past, as a result of they really feel like they should pay me. They’re like, ⁓ I want your recommendation. I spoke to you.

Priya Bhola Rathod (05:19)
Mm-hmm.

Sure.

However I really like that

they’re respectful of your occupation, proper? I’m like that with mates who do sure issues who’re, you realize, within the magnificence trade or within the medical trade, you realize, who assist me out with issues. I’m at all times very acutely aware of claiming, don’t anticipate you to do that without spending a dime since you’re my pal, you realize? So I really like that they are saying that to you.

Renata Bernarde (05:34)
Yeah.

So.

Sure. my God. I imply,

you’re precisely proper. And I used to be occupied with that this morning as a result of I used to be recognized with osteoarthritis on my palms and I’ve a pal who’s an knowledgeable on this and I actually wish to at all times be texting her, however I can’t, I really feel unhealthy.

Priya Bhola Rathod (06:05)
Sure.

Precisely. I imply, I agree. I’ve a pal who’s

a really nice physician in girls’s Health. so she’s identical factor. I take into consideration what number of, what’s my quota of questions for her this month? What number of ought to I ask her? However much like you, I really like serving to folks. And so I believe as part of our nature, we possible much like our mates wish to assist after we can.

Renata Bernarde (06:18)
So.

Yeah. ⁓

That’s nice. Now, one of many issues that lots of my purchasers and my purchasers are like a bit pocket of listeners, proper? Most of my purchasers come from listening to the podcast. So I correlate that, you realize, this is perhaps a problem or a problem that lots of them face is that a few of them want to alter industries. IT’s not like they wish to, a few of they wish to, however lots of them want to alter industries.

Priya Bhola Rathod (06:48)
Proper.

Hmm?

Renata Bernarde (07:08)
And also you’ve completed that. You went from, you realize, trade to trade. What kind of recommendation would you give or what helped you personally make these transitions from trade to trade?

Priya Bhola Rathod (07:21)
I believe there’s a few issues which have helped me try this. And one, suppose, is one thing we advise job seekers and Certainly to do on a regular basis, which is upskilling for the subsequent job you need. And that doesn’t essentially imply doing a complete formal schooling or a grasp’s. IT simply means understanding what are the sorts of expertise you want for that new trade or that new function. And are there methods you could purchase a few of these or get certifications or take

programs in these earlier than you modify or attempt to change to a brand new function or trade. In order that’s one thing I’ve at all times completed. After which two is simply figuring out these transferable expertise. So that’s one thing I needed to do, particularly with an Certainly, and I’ll let you know my story in a minute, however what are the transferable expertise I’ve or the institutional data I’ve from one space of a job or an trade that I can apply?

⁓ at present to a different function or trade. So I believe figuring out that’s actually, actually key. After which a part of me is, you realize, this is applicable to extra to job seekers who’re altering roles inside their firm. However one factor I’ve at all times completed is do sides of the function earlier than I even get IT. So for me at Certainly, I’ve requested if I wish to transfer into a distinct division, can I shadow you?

Is there any work that you just’re doing proper now that I might sit in on just a few of the calls or assist out in a small capability? As a result of that does two issues. One, IT helps you be taught the brand new function and what you would possibly have to get into IT. However two, IT helps present that group how succesful you might be or what completely different expertise you would possibly deliver to that place which might be helpful. So these are three key issues I’ve completed with a view to…

change industries or change roles. After which I believe lastly, within the financial system we’re dwelling in proper now, which may be very difficult and the job market might be very difficult, IT’s simply having the boldness to do IT. I believe that is one thing I discuss to folks about on a regular basis is, have the boldness to strive one thing new and have the boldness and the expertise that you just deliver to the desk.

Renata Bernarde (09:40)
Yeah, I agree. I’ve been working with plenty of purchasers and plenty of volunteering that I’ve been doing as properly with folks which might be attempting to alter industries. And what you’re saying is spot on. One of many difficulties that I discover that they’ve is the change of the jargon, the change of the narrative. And I discover that that may be a actually attention-grabbing state of affairs.

Priya Bhola Rathod (09:52)
Mm-hmm.

Sure.

Renata Bernarde (10:10)
⁓ And one of many issues that I miss essentially the most in regards to the time I used to be in company is the place are the newspapers? Folks don’t learn the information anymore. And I believe in case you are not conscious of the trade that you just wish to stroll into, then how will you be employed by that trade? Go learn The Economist, The Wall Avenue Journal, The New York Instances. I need you to be told.

Priya Bhola Rathod (10:20)
They don’t.

Sure!

That’s precisely proper. IT’s such as you’re studying my notes, Renata. I’m not kidding. IT’s like these are precisely a few of the issues I wrote down is that you just don’t wish to, should you’re going to stroll into a brand new trade, you wish to present adaptability. You wish to present data. You wish to present that you just care about that trade and also you’ve discovered about that trade. So to your level, you realize, studying the information, following their

Renata Bernarde (10:39)
Okay.

Priya Bhola Rathod (11:01)
firm on a number of completely different platforms, whether or not that be Certainly firm pages or their LinkedIn firm web page. Understanding what they’re doing and what’s necessary to them proper now could be going that will help you a lot once you stroll into IT. I additionally suppose that utilizing the instruments which might be obtainable to you on the market are actually necessary. So one factor I really like about Certainly is we have now this new hub for AARP and Certainly. IT’s a profession assets hub.

And so IT exhibits you particularly resume help, like job itemizing help, and IT’s tailor-made to older employees, which I like, as a result of I believe plenty of the narrative on the market generally proper now could be catered to youthful employees. And there’s plenty of older employees which might be making a profession change. We noticed a latest AARP survey that claims employees age 50 plus are planning to make a profession change this yr.

and 65 % of them haven’t taken any steps to arrange for this. So if you concentrate on IT, if 1 / 4 of employees age 50 plus try to make a change they usually haven’t ready for IT, they should entry the issues which might be obtainable to them on-line.

Renata Bernarde (12:14)
Completely. And the older employee must really feel extra assured about making use of and to be extra ⁓ updated with how recruitment and choice works now. I used to be mentioning to you earlier than that I interviewed two government search companions yesterday. ⁓ And this interview would be the episode earlier than this one, everybody, should you’re listening. They usually have been saying one thing that I believed was actually enjoyable. ⁓

Priya Bhola Rathod (12:19)
Sure.

Renata Bernarde (12:43)
50 is the brand new 40 and 60 is the brand new 50. then that, 20 years in the past, 30 years in the past once they began working as headhunters, they might by no means current a 55 yr previous individual to a shopper for a CEO place in the present day. They don’t suppose twice, 55 and 60. And the oldest one which they’ve interviewed for a CEO function was in his 80s. And that’s high-quality.

Priya Bhola Rathod (12:45)
Sure.

Mm-hmm.

Hmm?

Precisely.

Wow, that’s unimaginable.

Renata Bernarde (13:13)
That

was a shortlisted candidate for a task. And I believe that ⁓ folks overthink their age once they’re making use of for roles.

Priya Bhola Rathod (13:21)
That’s proper. They actually do. They usually

underestimate their capacity to be taught these new expertise and to be taught this new jargon. They will try this as properly. And so the opposite factor that we see job seekers doing generally, older job employees, is just not making use of to a task as a result of they suppose they’re overqualified for IT. And that may be a pitfall as a result of

Renata Bernarde (13:33)
Yeah.

Priya Bhola Rathod (13:47)
you might have the expertise that they want. You’ll be able to hit the bottom working. You can begin in a brand new trade and, you realize, shortly work your means up. So I believe you’re referring to all the proper issues, Renata. Like there’s a complete world on the market for job seekers, know, 45, 50 plus who wish to change careers.

Renata Bernarde (14:10)
Okay. ⁓ Earlier than we speak about overqualification, as a result of I wish to contact on that in a minute, ⁓ I nonetheless wish to undergo that trade transition and speak about networking, as a result of I do know you’ve emphasised the significance of networking over resumes, which I discover IT’s humorous since you work at Certainly, resumes are so necessary to your platform. However are you able to share what you imply by that and the way these two issues can go collectively to assist with the profession transition?

Priya Bhola Rathod (14:24)
Mm-hmm.

Sure, suppose, look, networking to me is just not one thing you simply do once you’re searching for a job, proper? Networking is one thing that must be fixed for you, you realize, for job seekers. And there’s so many alternative methods you possibly can community in in the present day’s market. So the primary is clearly in-person networking, proper? So going to networking occasions, et cetera. However on the earth we’re dwelling in in the present day, lots of people are busy they usually’re not doing as many issues in individual. So are you becoming a member of completely different

networking teams that meet just about you could be part of. I imply, I’m a part of talking teams. I’m a part of dad and mom and caregivers teams throughout, know, IT doesn’t need to be particular to your trade. IT might be particular to your pursuits. And thru your pursuits, you’re going to seek out individuals who have job alternatives obtainable for you. suppose the one factor I really like about networking is that

For me, the best way IT’s helped is folks speaking about me in rooms I’m not even in. Whereas Priya can be an incredible match for this chance. And so once you’re high of thoughts for folks and also you’re networking and also you’re sharing what you realize and what you need to supply, I believe IT might be invaluable. And I believe the opposite a part of networking, Renata, that’s actually necessary is the give and take.

You and I talked about this, proper? We mentor folks, however we even have our personal mentors. And so I believe that once you, IT’s giving again in each of these ways in which I believe is admittedly necessary. After which even once you’re networking on platforms like LinkedIn, for instance, proper? IT’s not nearly asking, asking and sharing your individual issues. IT’s about actively partaking in related content material. You touched on this earlier than, Renata. You stated, should you’re going to strive to enter an trade,

Know, find out about that trade, be educated on that trade. That performs into platforms like LinkedIn as properly, proper? Commenting on sure trade knowledge with some distinctive insights, know, following folks in that trade. IT’s simply actually necessary. So I nonetheless suppose resumes are extraordinarily necessary, however I believe networking is what’s going to get you within the door. After which having a strong resume to again up what you’ve been speaking about goes to get you precisely the place that you must go.

Renata Bernarde (16:59)
Sure, you’re proper. I at all times talked about this one shopper that I had, Priya, who instructed me he doesn’t community. And we received a job, you realize? And I stated, look, if that door is closed to you, should you refuse to speak to folks about your job search, about searching for work and attain out to your former colleagues, then that you must be…

Priya Bhola Rathod (17:09)
Sure.

Renata Bernarde (17:23)
wonderful at understanding how ATS works and all the things else to do with the interview. You can not play down the significance of being technically wonderful within the recruitment and choice course of should you refuse to do networking. 99 % of my purchasers, ideally what you need is to by no means not community, such as you stated, however by no means not perceive IT.

Priya Bhola Rathod (17:42)
Sure.

Precisely.

Renata Bernarde (17:52)
Individuals are necessary. That’s what we imply. IT’s about you being on the market for them once they want and also you being on the market and being weak sufficient to share what’s taking place to you and ask questions, ask for recommendation, not ask for a job. I believe that that’s an excessive amount of, however asking for recommendation, for perception is so related as you’re doing analysis about the place you’re going to go subsequent.

Priya Bhola Rathod (17:55)
Mm-hmm.

Precisely.

Renata, I couldn’t agree extra. For instance, let me let you know how I received my job at Certainly. So I’ve been at Certainly 9 plus years. And this was about perhaps a bit over 9 and a half years in the past. And I had two children underneath three. And I needed to re-enter the workforce. I used to be working half time. And I used to be actually nervous about IT. I’d been doing half time work. I’d been.

out of full-time work for not that lengthy, however you realize all the information round IT, proper? You reentering turns into more durable and more durable. And I occur to be having a dialog with a pal saying, I wish to reenter the workforce. Nevertheless, I wish to be with an organization that values, you realize, having a household or the place I can have some flexibility. And I’m actually involved about going again full-time when my children are so younger. And a pal of mine who labored at Certainly, I hadn’t even thought of Certainly.

I used to be taking a look at completely completely different industries. And he or she stated to me, why don’t you concentrate on Certainly? I’ve children. I work there. I really like IT. I might be glad to refer you. And that’s how she referred me, and I received the job at Certainly. But additionally, to that time, speaking in regards to the issues that you just worth in an organization and the issues which might be necessary to you. For me, an organization that valued parental advantages, work-life stability, all of that was necessary to me. And he or she knew that.

Certainly did that. to your level, be weak. Discuss what you’ve been by means of. What’s necessary to you shifting ahead so you’ll find the precise match.

Renata Bernarde (19:53)
Yeah, sure, you’re proper. I believe at occasions like this when ⁓ I used to be really commenting on a put up from a earlier podcast visitor, Lou Adler, I don’t know should you’ve heard of Lou, he coaches recruiters. He does on-line programs and applications for recruits. has some LinkedIn programs for those who wish to be good recruiters. And he was saying, you realize, we have to have this pact between the worker and the job candidate that must be

Priya Bhola Rathod (20:06)
What occurred? Okay.

Renata Bernarde (20:23)
agreed upon earlier than you rent them, you realize, in regards to the wants and needs of each of them and they should correlate. And he tagged me on the put up and I stated, I commented, Lou, I believe you’re completely proper. There’s a lot reality in what you’re saying. However at occasions like this, when there’s so the ratio of job candidates for roles is so uneven, IT’s a lot more durable for the job applicant to have a say and to make and to decide on.

In case you have that privilege of ready, of negotiating flexibility on the finish of the recruitment course of, nice. However most individuals are simply determined for a job. So I say this, Priya, as a result of you possibly can have stepping stones to attain your objectives. In the event you have been job looking in 2025 and the job market is shit now,

Priya Bhola Rathod (21:14)
Sure.

Renata Bernarde (21:21)
get no matter job you possibly can, I perceive that. However don’t neglect your objectives. Don’t neglect your ambitions. You’ll be able to return to them when the provision demand of roles is healthier, perhaps in a yr or so.

Priya Bhola Rathod (21:36)
Sure, and as soon as

you’re in an organization, Renata, then you may have the power to begin exploring different departments and determine what you need. For instance, once more, I’ve been in Certainly 9 and a half years, and now I’m within the job of my goals at Certainly. However that took a very long time and plenty of profession pivots. And to your level, once you’re searching for a job proper now, as a result of the market is tougher, IT may not have

all the things you need, however IT may need a chunk of what you need, proper? For instance, after I began in Certainly, I had expertise in gross sales. I went into gross sales. IT wasn’t precisely what I needed to do proper then, however I knew there have been different parts of the corporate that would afford me the life I needed. There was flexibility. There was work-life stability. So once you’re searching for a job proper now, IT will not be the proper job or the proper firm, however there’s a side of IT that’s going to work to your life proper now, and IT’s going to will let you get in.

, construct a presence for your self and pivot and switch.

Renata Bernarde (22:33)
Yeah, yeah, no, that’s completely proper. And what you probably did as properly, going again to full-time employment, is one thing that plenty of the listeners will relate to in the event that they’ve taken outing for maternity go away. My older purchasers have taken break day to care for folks that have been sick, they have been sick themselves, divorced. Like there’s a lot that occurs in…

Priya Bhola Rathod (22:44)
Sure.

Mm-hmm.

Sure.

Renata Bernarde (22:58)
in a lifespan that requires your consideration and you may’t simply handle work and know caring for an aged member of the family that’s you realize not unwell ⁓ and that would take two three 4 years till they really feel like they’ll cope return to full-time employment so what do you suppose ⁓ helped you may have the boldness to undergo the recruitment and choice did you tackle that you just have been returning to full-time employment

in the course of the interviews. Are you able to increase on that?

Priya Bhola Rathod (23:30)
Sure, and I did, I completely addressed IT and I believe that’s one thing job seekers ought to do proper now. I believe there’s the inclination to draw back from IT and never tackle IT and simply type of brush IT off and hope they don’t discover. However initially, there’s nothing incorrect with taking a bit little bit of a break. Once more, if IT’s to take care of a member of the family, if IT’s due to medical causes, life occurs.

Proper, and so long as you tackle IT and present what you discovered from IT and why you wish to return into the workforce full time, I believe that’s extraordinarily necessary. I did completely tackle IT and say, I’m doing part-time work proper now. I’m in enterprise growth and on digicam work in manufacturing, and I wish to get again into IT full time. I believe Certainly’s the precise place for me. Right here’s my earlier expertise in gross sales. And in order that was.

that was welcome. And so what we advise job seekers on on a regular basis is addressing the hole. And I believe, Renata, on the earth we’re dwelling in in the present day, folks have gaps for therefore many causes. The pandemic simply occurred three to 5 years in the past. And lots of people exited the workforce for a number of causes throughout that point. And so I believe IT’s extra widespread than to not see these gaps on job seekers resumes. And simply

Renata Bernarde (24:44)
Yeah.

Priya Bhola Rathod (24:46)
Be, tackle IT, tackle IT in your cowl letter, tackle IT in your interview, simply don’t draw back from IT.

Renata Bernarde (24:53)
Yeah, it is a good time for us to debate overqualification. I’ve issues about that. So I agree with you that should you’re searching for Jobs and you may see a job that you just qualify to do, however perhaps IT’s been 5 years, 10 years because you’ve completed IT, ⁓ you was paid extra. ⁓

IT’s difficult. Folks could wish to apply for that job and generally they do after which they don’t get ⁓ an interview they usually can’t determine IT out why, you realize, and I inform them, I believe IT was since you have been overqualified, proper? The opposite factor that occurs is that they get the job ⁓ after which they’re extraordinarily sad as a result of unexpectedly they realized that they’re not the highest cat anymore. They’re not the choice makers.

They used to have the job that now their supervisor is doing they usually get a bit bit aggravated. So they need IT as a result of they want a job after which they get annoyed. And I’ve seen each of these sides as a profession coach. ⁓ I might love so that you can type of increase on that as a result of I believe we’re at a time now that we’re, know, beggars can’t be choosers. We have to apply for roles. So.

based mostly in your expertise and perhaps the information that you’ve got on LinkedIn, what’s one of the simplest ways to place your self for a job that you could be be overqualified?

Priya Bhola Rathod (26:21)
Yeah, I need

to deal with what you talked about earlier than first, which is should you’re labeled as overqualified, IT normally means an employer is worried about a few issues, proper? They’re involved that you just’re going to be too costly. They’re involved you’re going to get bored or go away for a greater alternative. So in circumstances the place you suppose you is perhaps overqualified and you’ll apply for the job, which I agree with you, you must, IT’s actually necessary to reframe the narrative to

Renata Bernarde (26:25)
Okay.

Priya Bhola Rathod (26:50)
emphasize your flexibility, your stability, and your real curiosity within the function, proper? So you are able to do that by means of a few issues. One is begin by tailoring your resume particularly to that function and emphasizing the abilities and experiences that align immediately with the function, proper? So IT’s…

Look, nobody likes modifying their resume over and over. IT’s far simpler to simply submit the identical one to each job, however I’m certain you advise your purchasers as properly, Renata, you’ve gotta tailor IT, proper? So in a state of affairs the place you’re certified, tailor IT, after which focus on how in an interview, should you get to the interview, focus on how as a result of you may have a lot of this earlier expertise, you possibly can deliver worth instantly.

Renata Bernarde (27:21)
Yeah.

Priya Bhola Rathod (27:37)
you possibly can hit the bottom working. Such as you gained’t want as a lot onboarding as somebody who doesn’t have as a lot expertise as you would possibly want. And you’ll even say one thing like, I’m enthusiastic about this place. IT permits me to make use of so lots of my earlier expertise and do all of this significant work. And I do know that my expertise offers me a robust basis to do that function. So I believe there’s a means for job seekers to deal with this.

of their resume and even of their interview in order that they’ll ease an worker’s, employer’s concern about this. As a result of whether or not employer is saying IT or not, that’s possible the priority they’ve, you realize? So that you wanna be capable to ease that. After which once more, I encourage them, IT’s, sure, plenty of us are in Jobs that, you realize, we wanna be in a distinct function or we wanna be in the next place, however.

Renata Bernarde (28:18)
Completely.

Priya Bhola Rathod (28:33)
I encourage your job seekers to consider, okay, that is the place I’m now. Fortunately I’ve a job. What are different issues that this job gives me? Is there an schooling stipend? Is there a solution to get extra RSUs or a greater 401k matching that’ll assist me do issues outdoors of labor which might be, you realize, deliver me pleasure or make me glad? And so I believe there’s simply a few issues they’ll do to reframe this, each once they’re sitting down in an interview and once they’re on the job.

Renata Bernarde (29:03)
And Priya, this must be thought-about ⁓ even outdoors the difficulty of being overqualified for roles. I’ll provide you with a few examples. ⁓ I had a shopper as soon as that had completed wealth administration in a financial institution in Europe, and he was the supervisor of over 300 personnel, proper? After which he moved to Australia, and Australia is a small nation. He was going to be doing wealth administration by himself. So having in his resume,

Priya Bhola Rathod (29:24)
you

Renata Bernarde (29:33)
that he used to have a workforce of 300 with 10 direct experiences doesn’t actually assist this financial institution in Australia perceive that he can function independently. So I requested him to take away that from his resume and he didn’t as a result of generally ego will get in the best way.

Priya Bhola Rathod (29:45)
Sure.

Sure.

Renata Bernarde (29:56)
And he stated, however that’s my expertise. I have to have IT there. I’m like, that have will, ⁓ IT’s type of, IT’s type of scary for a rustic and a financial institution of this dimension that you just’re making use of for. You’re going to be working fully alone, working with excessive web price people, however not on the stage that’s completed in Europe. Proper. So ⁓

Priya Bhola Rathod (30:21)
Sure.

Renata Bernarde (30:22)
The opposite instance that I wish to give, which is also about scale, is that this superb shopper. I simply completed working along with her and he or she took an organization from a income of 4 billion to a income of 60 billion. There are different organizations that will welcome you with open arms, however that instance is an excessive amount of for them. They’ll suppose you’re overqualified and they won’t rent you.

Priya Bhola Rathod (30:44)
IT’s

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah, to your level, I believe the thought of tailoring IT to that function, I particularly like that first instance as a result of I believe that taking all that have and saying capacity to function independently for very excessive web price people and specializing in perhaps what the online price was versus his ab-

you realize, managing so many individuals is tailoring IT particularly to that job, that function, that firm, that nation, you realize, so you need to, to your level, take away any want to make IT appear larger than IT is if you wish to get a task that is sensible for you proper now.

Renata Bernarde (31:16)
you

Yeah.

Sure, that’s very true. that’s an incredible tip there. ⁓ Now, if we take into consideration ⁓ what’s taking place, let’s speak about synthetic intelligence, If you’re trying on the knowledge that’s coming by means of certainly, is IT doable so that you can inform us should you see a distinction in the best way persons are writing resumes and answering questions for…

Priya Bhola Rathod (31:52)
Sure. ⁓

Renata Bernarde (32:05)
job purposes in another way as a result of they’re utilizing AI? Is IT doable to type of analyze that in the intervening time?

Priya Bhola Rathod (32:11)
, Renata,

I’ll need to look into that for you. I don’t know of any knowledge that we have now at present. I imply, I do know that, you realize, there, we do advise job seekers to make use of a mixture of AI and in-person teaching, proper? As a result of I believe AI can solely accomplish that a lot. There are nuances that somebody who’s been in an trade or has been teaching folks may give you. And we have now…

Renata Bernarde (32:30)
Mm.

Priya Bhola Rathod (32:40)
Certainly articles on the profession information, we have now profession coaches for resume. And so we advise to do a mixture of each ⁓ as a result of I believe you then’re not in, ⁓ you you may make certain the abilities are literally one thing you possibly can ship. And so I believe that’s actually necessary. I do wish to contact on a research we did on Certainly that discovered that we analyzed 2,800 expertise. ⁓

to see if any of them have been at full danger of being changed by AI. And we discovered that none of them have been at excessive danger of being totally changed by AI. So let me say that once more, as a result of I really feel like I stated IT in type of a complicated means. Certainly knowledge discovered that not one of the 2,800 scales IT analyzed have been at excessive danger of being totally changed by AI.

So what meaning to us is human experience continues to be extraordinarily useful. So what our chief economist likes to say, Svenja Goodell, which we love is AI may not change your job, however somebody who is aware of tips on how to use IT would possibly. So the one factor that’s necessary for any of your job seekers listening, irrespective of the place they’re at of their profession is

understanding how AI is related to the trade you’re in or the trade you’re making use of for and attempting to upscale, proper? There’s numerous programs, you realize, Certainly has a partnership with Udemy that ⁓ we make obtainable. There’s, you realize, a number of completely different programs that your listeners can take, however IT’s necessary to grasp AI and perceive how IT’s related to your trade, much like what you talked about earlier than.

understanding what’s occurring in your trade. A part of that’s understanding what’s occurring inside AI in your trade.

Renata Bernarde (34:34)
Sure, you’re completely proper. I believe that there are two issues that have to occur on the identical time. being extra refined utilizing synthetic intelligence your self for help in your recruitment and choice course of that will help you navigate your job search. In order that’s one factor. And the opposite much more necessary factor is what you’ve simply stated, utilizing AI, ⁓ understanding how AI will impression.

Priya Bhola Rathod (34:46)
Sure.

Renata Bernarde (35:03)
your job, your profession, your trade and workforce usually sooner or later so that you just’re a part of this alteration and never lagging behind. So these are two various things. As a profession coach, not a lot, you realize, working with, I imply, in fact I’ll inform them to incorporate AI as a part of their skilled growth.

Priya Bhola Rathod (35:15)
Proper.

Renata Bernarde (35:30)
However my concern is how they’re utilizing AI to use for Jobs. And yesterday we had a enjoyable time on the podcast in the direction of the tip after which I finished the recording and we stored going ⁓ speaking about the truth that you go on LinkedIn and you may’t perceive what folks do anymore. IT’s simply the…

Priya Bhola Rathod (35:35)
Mm-hmm.

Renata Bernarde (35:52)
bunch of jargons that persons are utilizing and IT’s so evident. Look, let’s not fully blame AI right here as a result of even earlier than synthetic intelligence, IT was already onerous. Folks have been very generic and vanilla in the best way that they have been presenting themselves on LinkedIn. You’ll be able to’t determine what they do. However now with AI, IT’s simply change into worse. Yeah.

Priya Bhola Rathod (36:10)
Proper.

⁓ I do know. that’s

why IT’s so, IT’s, you’re, you’re proper about that. Proper. And IT’s humorous as a result of whilst certainly we encourage employers once they’re doing their job postings to not attempt to make IT too inventive to the purpose the place a job seeker doesn’t perceive what they’re making use of for. Proper. Like IT must not, generally we’re attempting to be too out of the field, too overly inventive, you realize, name a place what IT is. If IT’s a software program engineer.

name IT a software program engineer. And so I believe that to your level, perhaps we’ve received gone the opposite means on the best way we speak about ourselves as properly, you realize, and I believe there’s this inclination to make all the things sound grandiose or tremendous inventive or tremendous out of the field. And so I agree. suppose generally sticking to the fundamentals to your level additionally helps an employer perceive what IT is that you just deliver to the desk.

Renata Bernarde (36:51)
Yeah.

Sure.

Completely. I’m an enormous fan of stating your ethos, what IT is that you just do very clearly at the start. I don’t even care anymore if IT contains I’ve I’m an skilled undertaking supervisor with over 20 years of expertise working in telecommunications, scaling up, you realize, this and that kind of of of ⁓ of initiatives. I need.

the clarification of what precisely your space of experience is and your industries that you just’ve labored ⁓ in capabilities or areas and so forth. Folks used to say, ⁓ don’t put 10 plus years of expertise anymore. And I’m like, I’m so confused. Like, I don’t know. I don’t know what folks do anymore. Let’s return to, sure.

Priya Bhola Rathod (37:45)
Sure.

Yeah. IT is so complicated. IT is so

complicated. You probably did contact on one thing necessary although, Renata, which is updating your resume to be type of extra of this purposeful resume format, proper? Actually together with upfront what IT is that you just deliver to the desk versus the old-fashioned means of simply the chronological order of your Jobs, proper? As a substitute, IT’s to your level saying upfront the place

Renata Bernarde (38:14)
Thank

Sure.

Priya Bhola Rathod (38:27)
an employer can see IT, what are the abilities that you just possess? What do you deliver to the desk? How is IT related to that job? After which following up with different issues that they might wish to see in that backup, that first part.

Renata Bernarde (38:41)
Yeah, and IT’s actually attention-grabbing as a result of we’ve gone international, I believe with Certainly and LinkedIn, we have now globalized recruitment and choice and job purposes and whatnot. ⁓ Nevertheless, as a result of I work with purchasers all around the world, like severely, I’ve purchasers in each continent within the… Yeah, IT’s actually attention-grabbing. However I see the cultural distinction in the best way that they narrate their tales.

Priya Bhola Rathod (38:51)
Sure. Sure.

Superb.

Mm-hmm.

Renata Bernarde (39:09)
So if

you suppose that within the US folks begin from the start, you must see my Jap purchasers. In case you are in Asia, you begin from childhood. Once I was a bit lady, my grandfather used to inform me, and that’s how they do IT. And I’ve seen that within the US as properly not too long ago. ⁓ People who begin with plenty of emotive language at the start of their about part on LinkedIn.

Priya Bhola Rathod (39:17)
The top. The top.

Sure.

Sure.

Mm-hmm.

Renata Bernarde (39:35)
you realize,

what they’re keen about, the issues that make them tick. And I’m like, we don’t have time for that. Recruiters have 10 seconds.

Priya Bhola Rathod (39:43)
You combine precisely,

like what’s IT that you just’re bringing to the desk and to your level, like catering that to every function. I imply, not essentially, you realize, the wonderful thing about Certainly as properly is you possibly can create your profile and you may create, you realize, completely different resumes underneath that profile to use for various Jobs. And so IT permits you type of that flexibility. And so actually occupied with the sorts of Jobs you’re making use of to and making IT stick.

, and making IT fast, such as you stated, as a result of everybody resides in an surroundings proper now which is so fast-paced they usually don’t have the time.

Renata Bernarde (40:18)
Yeah,

sure, that’s fascinating. I didn’t know that you possibly can have completely different resumes contained in the LinkedIn platform. In order that’s actually cool.

Priya Bhola Rathod (40:27)
Yeah, Certainly does have

completely different, a capability to have completely different resumes you could shoot out. And in order that’s necessary to know.

Renata Bernarde (40:36)
Good, good. ⁓ We spoke about tradition earlier than and I used to be to know if you realize about indicators of tradition as persons are making use of for Jobs. know, anecdotally, I discuss to my purchasers quite a bit in regards to the crimson flags and the inexperienced flags and the recruitment course of. However what do you suppose job seekers must be searching for once they’re

going by means of the job utility and in taking a look at accepting a proposal. ⁓

Priya Bhola Rathod (41:11)
Yeah, there’s

a few issues I needed to do, however I simply realized I took a fast look at my notes from NADA and I spotted there have been some AI issues I needed so as to add in. Is that okay if we return a bit bit? ⁓ So I simply noticed a stat that I had written down that, you realize, for Certainly, for job seekers who’re utilizing Certainly, ⁓ you realize, your Certainly profile, like we talked about, IT’s actually the important thing to unlocking these higher alternatives on the positioning.

Renata Bernarde (41:21)
Okay. Yeah. ⁓

Priya Bhola Rathod (41:41)
Proper? So it’s also possible to put your {qualifications} and your preferences in that profile. And job seekers with preferences or {qualifications} saved of their profile are 82 % extra prone to be contacted by an employer after submitting an utility than these with out. So IT’s necessary that when job seekers are taking a look at their total Certainly profile, proper?

Renata Bernarde (42:02)
Okay.

Priya Bhola Rathod (42:08)
their resume, they’ll additionally put of their preferences, their {qualifications}. And so IT’s necessary to make that profile as strong as doable. ⁓ I believe we even have new AI instruments that may match them with alternatives. They will apply to Jobs with only a click on of a button and received contacted by employers immediately.

They usually may even, with our platform, schedule interviews inside 24 hours once they’re working with completely different employers. So I did wish to name that out. I spotted I forgot to, however I did wish to name out that Certainly does have ⁓ some fairly cool AI instruments proper now that job seekers wish to reap the benefits of.

Renata Bernarde (42:50)
Wow.

Is there anything in your notes that you just suppose folks don’t know that we have to share with them?

Priya Bhola Rathod (42:59)
I’m attempting. I

am having a look in any respect the notes I took. ⁓

I just- there’s a- yeah

Renata Bernarde (43:06)
Whilst you look, take a look and I’m going to

say this to the listeners. One factor that I at all times advocate folks to do is to max out on the phrase depend when you’re giving Information about your self. So after I’m telling folks tips on how to use Chat2BT, you realize you could customise Chat2BT they usually ask, know, inform me about your self and the way do you wish to work with Chat2BT. ⁓ Don’t be shy.

Priya Bhola Rathod (43:28)
Sure.

Renata Bernarde (43:33)
Don’t be one-liner with Chat2BT. Simply max out, say, you realize, as a lot as doable. Give as a lot Information as doable. Yeah. I additionally am about to begin selling a platform known as Collings AI. And once more, I’ve examined IT out and I maxed out on all the things. And the output was…

Priya Bhola Rathod (43:39)
Lastly…

Renata Bernarde (43:56)
So spectacular. So I’m assuming IT’s the identical with the Certainly platform. In the event you max out on explaining your self, the output is healthier. And yet another factor, yet another factor that I believe is admittedly necessary. And once more, take heed to the episode from final week as a result of we mentioned this. One web page resumes. I do know Individuals love one web page resumes. They don’t work anymore, I don’t suppose. As a result of should you…

Priya Bhola Rathod (44:00)
IT is.

Sure.

Renata Bernarde (44:22)
enter a one web page resume right into a platform like OpenAI, they don’t have plenty of Information from you with a view to get to to spit out good solutions to interview questions and, you realize, a pitch for you. Whereas in Australia, the place we will have three, 4 web page resumes, ⁓ OpenAI has rather more Information from you.

Proper? So even should you’re not going to ship out a 4 web page resume, have a doc that you need to use to mess around that has a way more Information about you, extra particulars, in order that should you’re enjoying with AI, attempting to arrange for job interviews, the machine may have extra Information from you. So yeah, that’s what I needed to say.

Priya Bhola Rathod (45:00)
Sure.

However you’re precisely

proper. That’s what I simply saying in regards to the Certainly Profiles is don’t, I do know IT’s quite a bit simpler to simply put in that one resume and transfer on, however to your level, once you put in your expertise, your {qualifications}, you make your Certainly Profile as strong as doable. Employers have much more Information to work with, you realize, they usually have much more Information about you to grasp how you could be related to their function.

⁓ I, I do wish to agree with what you stated earlier than too, is that once you’re advertising your self on on-line, you wish to be clear, however you wish to be human, proper? You don’t wish to be everywhere, you realize, begin with a headline that goes past your job title, however you realize, save all of that different Information for the about you part, you realize, and should you’re holding your expertise updated and related, be sure to’re addressing that too, placing that in your certainly profile.

placing that in your resume. These are issues that may aid you get the job you wish to get and present employers. ⁓ I do wish to return to how somebody can perceive the corporate tradition, as a result of I do know we type of went off that for a minute. ⁓ However there’s a few methods. I believe that Certainly has these items known as firm pages.

Renata Bernarde (46:22)
Yeah. ⁓

Priya Bhola Rathod (46:32)
Okay, so there are pages which might be in regards to the firm and what’s nice about them is IT has, you realize, critiques certainly and our sister firm, Glassdoor. So certainly firm pages and Glassdoor critiques. IT has critiques by present and former workers. IT permits them to rank sure issues, you realize, work-life stability, you realize, sure advantages, you realize, 401k matching. And so that you wish to have an underneath, if you wish to have an understanding, that is

knowledge that’s inputted by precise workers. And so IT’s necessary so that you can type of do your analysis. After which once you’re within the interview, ask some diplomatic however clear questions. What does profession growth appear to be at this firm? Do you may have any inclusion useful resource enterprise teams? Ask these issues that aid you perceive what the corporate tradition is like.

After which see what the interview course of is, as a result of that provides you a reasonably good thought of what the tradition goes to be like. Is IT well timed? Are they clear? Are they sharing ⁓ subsequent steps with you? Does IT really feel like a course of that you just’re in when it comes to a partnership? And that’s going that will help you perceive what IT’s going to be like once you’re on the firm.

Renata Bernarde (47:49)
Yeah, no, I believe you’re completely proper ⁓ that ⁓ we have to cease romanticizing what IT would appear to be and use our instinct and the information and the Information. I Glassdoor is implausible as properly. I’ve plenty of time for Glassdoor. Final evening, a shopper of mine stated, simply received a job supply. Ought to I?

Priya Bhola Rathod (48:05)
Sure.

Renata Bernarde (48:15)
, I believe IT’s a bit on the low finish. I negotiate? And I’m like, go to Glassdoor and test IT out. Take a look at the salaries on Glassdoor earlier than you play a hand that’s out of step with the corporate’s wage vary.

Priya Bhola Rathod (48:20)
Sure. ⁓

And what I typically advise mates to do as properly is what you simply stated with Glassdoor. After which there’s this device known as the Certainly Wage Tracker. And IT’s a device that exhibits, you realize, to your place per location, what’s the typical wage vary? And so that you’re entering into, such as you stated, armed with that knowledge, proper? Like understanding your function and in addition your particular area. As a result of generally IT’s

As you realize, IT varies area to area. And so I believe being ready and understanding the information goes that will help you make sound selections.

Renata Bernarde (49:08)
Sure, that’s fantastic. ⁓ I’ve discovered a lot. I wish to go to Certainly now and perform a little research for my purchasers.

Priya Bhola Rathod (49:12)
Thanks.

Effectively, Renata,

I need you to be my profession coach. I imply, all the issues that you just’re providing your purchasers are invaluable.

Renata Bernarde (49:22)
Yeah, no, thanks a lot. Look, I believe you’re proper. IT’s a partnership between what you’ll find on-line and having conversations with any person like me who may give some perception due to all of the purchasers that I’ve and all of the… I reside and breathe this as you. So IT’s…

Priya Bhola Rathod (49:37)
Sure.

Sure. And you’ve got that

anecdotal expertise, proper? IT’s not simply what AI is spitting out. IT’s what you’ve skilled personally along with your purchasers.

Renata Bernarde (49:49)
Yeah.

Yeah, I really like what you stated earlier than about certainly placing out job adverts for the corporate which might be a bit extra particular and clear as a result of one of many issues that I generally get consulted, most of my consultations are interview prep. In order that’s, you realize, in fact, type of apparent. a few of them, you realize, folks which have been making use of for a number of Jobs they usually don’t perceive why they didn’t get interviewed.

Priya Bhola Rathod (50:11)
Mm-hmm.

Sure.

Renata Bernarde (50:22)
And IT’s as a result of the Jobs are so unclear that they felt like they may do them. After which once they discuss to any person like me, and I’m like, I do know IT appears to be like like you possibly can do IT, however what they have been really searching for is X, Y, Z. So IT offers them a bit bit extra perception that they actually gained’t be capable to discover anyplace else about which Jobs ⁓ are going to transform higher for them and which not. So, yeah.

Priya Bhola Rathod (50:36)
Proper.

Sure.

Sure, precisely. And data is energy,

data and preparation.

Renata Bernarde (50:53)
Sure, look, I might discuss to you underwater, might discuss to you endlessly, however IT was fantastic to have you ever right here. Is there any type of closing recommendation or ideas that you just wish to go away with the listeners?

Priya Bhola Rathod (50:56)
I knew you.

⁓ Thanks.

No, you realize, I simply wish to go away along with your job seekers is look within the financial system and we’re in proper now, I perceive that the job search and the job interview course of is difficult and I need them to know they’re not alone. There are such a lot of job seekers going by means of that proper now and that, you realize, with assets such as you and Certainly and the preparation they do, they’ll actually stroll in additional assured into these interviews and

hopefully get the job they need.

Renata Bernarde (51:37)
Yeah, in fact. I completely 100 % agree. And there’s a job on the market for everybody. I believe that within the nations that I’m lucky to work with, the unemployment fee signifies that you’re going to get a job should you use the assets on the market and you’ve got the grit and perseverance and perceive that some years are higher than others. 2025 will not be the most effective yr for job seekers.

Priya Bhola Rathod (51:45)
Sure.

Sure.

Renata Bernarde (52:07)
however that doesn’t imply that there isn’t a job on the market for you. So use Certainly, take heed to the pod, subscribe to the pod should you’re listening and also you’re not subscribed. And you will see that your job, we’re right here for you. Thanks a lot, Priya.

Priya Bhola Rathod (52:14)
Thanks.

That’s nice. Thank

you, Renata. Have a beautiful night. Bye.